[nos-bbs] Missing something more basic?

[George (Skip) VerDuin]

Hey Barry, kewl response.

Allow me to begin by focus on your last thought "absolutely NOTHING"...
My vision is to establish a parallel path to say your home internet
presence for multiple services like SMTP, ftp, http, (etc?).
Path 1 is from my LAN workstation out the dsl bridge now in place - and
as you see it works OK in client-server mode.
Path 2 is from my LAN workstation out the (jnos?) bridge over 44... now
in place - and you see it fails (I can't ping you).
Path 2 has LONG latency and will not be chosen until path 1 dies - kewl
way to run a redundant network.

What gets in the way is that my jnos path does not NAT.
So the solution options under consideration below:

On Sat, 2006-07-22 at 12:14 -0400, Barry Siegfried wrote:

> ["George (Skip) VerDuin" <k8rra at ameritech.net> wrote]:
> 
> > The issue is:  my jnos does not do NAT (Network Address Translation).
> 
> NAT *can* be incorporated into JNOS.  NAT for xNOS was actually
> developed a long time ago.  It is simply a matter of somebody
> wanting to take the time to port it into JNOS.

No demand?  No action.  That seems very normal.
Yet this seems to play heavily in the comparison of winlink to jnos
without being focused on in the debate.

> 
> > I've stumbled into a wide interest issue:
> >
> > All you guys discussing IP over AX.25 - have you included ARP as
> > a part of overhead in your considerations?
> 
> ARP is a necessary part of any "broadcast" implementation of the
> link layer.  It is the only way to translate MAC (physical or
> callsign) "addresses" into IP addresses.

Clearly.  and without NAT it can't work for my configuration DESIRE.

> 
> > All you guys discussing routing between jnos nodes mounted on
> > 192.168.x.y private IP LANS have you considered NAT over RF?
> 
> All you guys discussing routing between jnos nodes mounted on
> private LANS have you considered configuring the LAN as part of
> the amprnet?  

Clearly a routing solution.  I suspect it becomes unmanageable to
administer such a beast internationally.
As an example:  
I'm now assigned 44.102.132.20 for say 6 months - but I'm not installed
into DNS yet so you will not find k8rra.ampr.org.
Whereas this situation is manageable today, consider applying it under
emergency conditions when you might NEED to find k8rra....
I believe private LANs and NAT offers a more manageable approach - not
perhaps ideal.

> This can be done to the extent that individual
> machines on your LAN can be made as "public" or "private" as you
> want them to be by some simple IP routing manipulation in them
> and in the IP/NAT router and also with the proper configuration
> of an IPIP (or IPUDP) encapper as a "public" member of your LAN.

I need to know more engineering behind this and I expect to over time...

> 
> > Other solutions than NAT?  Yes potentially.  ENCAP comes to mind,
> > but I have not got a working example yet.  NAT as a solution?
> 
> In my own experience what seems to work best is a delicate combination
> of NAT (in a commercially available IP/NAT router) AND IPIP (or IPUDP)
> encapsulation to handle the "public" reachability of 44-net.

This suggests that NAT applied to RF links is a bad solution?  OK let me
think this over?

> 
> [snip]
> 
> > Now I don't know if there is a solution to my desire.>SNIP< I guess what I am not understanding
> is what you are trying to accomplish for which you can't find the
> solution.

Does this further information muddy the water?

> 
> > As far as a solution to my desire? - I'm beginning to classify it as
> > "pie in the sky"...
> 
> There is absolutely NOTHING you cannot do without the right software
> and some proper planning and configuration.
> 
> 73, de Barry, K2MF >>
>            o
>           <|>      Barry Siegfried
> +---------/-\---------------------------+
> | Internet | bgs at mfnos.net              |
> | HomePage | http://www.mfnos.net/~bgs  |
> +----------+----------------------------+
> | Amprnet  | k2mf at nnj.k2mf.ampr.org     |
> | PBBS     | k2mf at k2ge.#cnj.nj.usa.noam |
> +----------+----------------------------+
> 
> _______________________________________________
> nos-bbs mailing list
> nos-bbs at lists.tapr.org
> https://lists.tapr.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/nos-bbs


73
de Skip k8rra k


-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://lists.tapr.org/pipermail/nos-bbs_lists.tapr.org/attachments/20060722/88d0abfc/attachment.html>