[aprssig] Future Concept for APRS

[Matti Aarnio]

On Mon, Sep 21, 2009 at 02:03:39PM +0100, Dave Baxter wrote:
> > This is too bad that Finland has hacked up the APRS network and does 
> > not  allow two-way messaging.  This is a shock to me and to all APRS 
> > travelers!  And it shows why messaging does not work well via Igates 
> > beacuse of such local draconian hacks... that destroy the integrity of
> 
> > the APRS network and Global APRS-IS connectivity!
> 
> Not just Finland.
> 
> Sadly here in the UK, due to some "interesting licensing issues", we now
> have to get a NOV (Notice of Variation) to our licences, to run digi's,
> (third party traffic) especialy if unattended.

We have wondered about UK rules.  Things do sound very grim in deed.

> As to messaging, well, again, though it's easy to put up a RX only
> iGate, to mobiles can be tracked etc, to enable two way messaging,
> again, NOV is needed.   There are many "unlicensed" RX only gates about,
> in sort of stealth mode (they never TX to RF) as it's easy to do.  But
> strictly, because it's "interconnecting" the amateur network with the
> "Public" internet, we should probably have a NOV for that too, but
> most/many do not.

Really, also HAM band receivers need licenses?  Transmitters are
understandably licensable but receivers should not need such ?

My friend says that "Yes, OfCom is that *****".

Ouch...

> The trouble with NOV's, is the need for key-holding (as in door key)
> shutdown opp's, 3 or more, so that if needed, said station can be killed
> within half an hour of someone (in "authority") deciding it needs to
> QRT, and making some phone call's.  Remote shutdown (by any means) is
> not allowed.   Sadly, in our society, even good friends/neighbours baulk
> at being "volunteered" for that, when they learn that they may
> (unlikely, but they may) be called by a government department and asked
> to shutdown some equipment in someone else's house!..

A locked box outside the house with "emergency stop" button in it is
not acceptable "remote" method ?  No need to go inside, just to press
the button, and transmitters will silence ?

In Finland we used to have similar "30 minutes from notification to
shutdown" rule on automatic station licenses.  That was discarded some
20 years ago.

Anyway we do take our automatic transmitters seriously, and equip them
with analog one-shot timers that will terminate overlong transmission
by means of removing power from transmitter, and being restorable only
by manual action (button pressing.)  A couple hours long timer makes
"visit necessary" shutdown, and shorter ones make various reset attempts.

The RSBG should really negotiate an update on these rules, but OfCom
has rather difficult reputation...

BTW: We have received calls from local version of FCC/OFCOM, sometimes
transmitters do fail, and start producing wide interference signals.
Usually this co-incides with a thunderstorm hitting at nearby structures.
Direct hit at the site produces usually fried electronics, not merely
malfunctioning systems.


> Two way messaging does work in some places, but it depends on you (the
> mobile/portable etc) being in range of a main iGate, where the sysop has
> enabled it.  Many have not.
> 
> Coupled too, with on occasions, either by mistake or on purpose, some
> sysops seem to set things up to spew out IS traffic, onto our 2m
> frequency, and with long (7 hops) paths too.   Even "dumb tracking" is
> near on impossible under that onslaught.

Somebody(TM) should write some stories about APRS in RSGB magazines, and
put an infobox of good settings, and why bad settings are really bad...

We do such a story here in OH roughly yearly.

Ah yes,  volunteer emergency services in cases like search of elderly AWOL
from pensionate.  Teams carry trackers, and co-ordinator looks at aprs.fi
map base on where everybody are.  Team(s) also bring an rx-only igate on
location to make sure that the data gets to APRS-IS (APRS-IS connectivity
as well as access to aprs.fi is done using commercial mobile phone data
service.)

As a backup, Xastir and UIview are available.

Two-way trackers are not necessary, search co-ordinator commands teams
via FM voice radio.

Only vehicle tracking?   Tracking foot patrols, dog teams, ...

Lattest search task a few hours ago did find the target in the forest.
Sadly too late.


> All in all, a pretty sorry state, and sadly unlikely to improve in the
> future AFIK in the UK.
> 
> For me, APRS is a dead duck, I've not even used the D7 as a tracker in
> ages, let alone powered up the TNC at home.  Sometimes I'll fire up
> UiView and "listen" to the IS stream, maybe in a hotel room I'll use the
> IS for some messaging but that's all (cant use RF, as most hotels here
> are swathed in DC-Light QRM 24/7!) if I've had to buy some time on the
> so called "free" WiFi, and I've got some access time left after doing
> the work stuff that is.

Damn Greens in EU...  (I use only inductively ballast T8-tubes myself,
those tubes are cheap, housings not so.)

"Good Intentions" produce seriously bad RFI issues.

> I'm even wondering about continuing to monitor this list or not, as all
> I ever see is the same subjects going round and round, with no "real
> forward development" of the basic APRS system ever getting off the
> ground.  With the possible exception of the guys in the NE USA, running
> 9600bd on UHF, and a few notable individuals still experimenting with
> new methods, but often getting less than encouraging replies to their
> questions or announcements.   The APRS-UK list is *Very quiet* these
> days too.

Sounds very depressing.   Well, this is a hobby, and requiring too serious
approach on it is counterproductive in itself.  (Like UK rules on automatic
transmitters.)  But still one should not accept rock bottom low standards
on things like transmitter on remote location jamming the radio channel.

> Sorry for the negative waves, but that's how some of us see it from over
> here.
> 
> 73.
> Dave G0WBX.

73 de Matti, OH2MQK