[aprssig] New Mexico and Arizona... New n-N Paradigm

Wed Jan 19 13:51:20 EST 2005

>... overlapping digi coverage around Albuquerque.  When 
>driving around the local area I run 5 watts, simple whip,
> and RELAY,WIDE.  I often see 5 or 6 repeats of "My Position". 

This is one of the main reasons for the New n-N paradigm.
Change this to simply the path of WIDE2-2 and you will
not see any dupes. (though you will see one copy for each
digipeater you can hear)...

The New n-N Paradigm includes  no longer encouraging
the use of RELAY,WIDE type paths which generage
explosive dupes.  The fill-in digipeaters that used to be
RELAY only should now support RELAY and WIDE2-2
or be full WIDEn-N or SSn-N digis.

>BTW, a way to test for how much "n-N" you need...
>is to send yourself a couple email messages.  Watch 
>for a "My Message" echo so you know a digi saw you, 
>and then wait for an ACK.  Do that a couple times at
>different path settings.  No ACK indicates you may need 
>to increase the "N".

Maybe I am missing something, but this will tell you 
nothig about getting into an IGate.  At the first digi
your station will see its own message and may
generate the ack there.  (though that shouldnt happen
since stations are not supposed to be capturing their
own packets...  You may want to elaborate a little more
on what you meant?

Bob

--
J. Gary Bender, WS5N
Tijeras, New Mexico USA

On Wed, 19 Jan 2005 08:27:15 -0500, Robert Bruninga wrote:
> For NM (and AZ I think) which has most of their populations near the
> center of the state, I think the best fix wouild be:
>
> 1) Make UITRACE in all digis support NMn-N.  This will instantly
stop
> all WIDEn-N QRM
>
> 2) Put WIDE2-2 and WIDE3-3 in the UIDIGI list.  This will continue
to
> support mobiles driving through with those courteous paths.
>
> 3) They may leave UIFLOOD WIDEn-N in the extreme border digis
> (wilderness) since it wont hurt them in Albuquerque But These digis
will
> still have NMn-N too in the UITRACE parameter.
>
> THey can do this overnight.  Done.
>
>
> THis lets the WIDEn-N fly around the wilderness edges of the state,
but
> dones not focus it all inward which is what is happening now...
>
> de WB4APR, Bob
> .
>
>
> Easiest fix it sounds like in NM is to turn all the digis into NMn-N
new
> mexico digis.  This will work wonderfully in states like Arizona and
NM
> where most of the central population is central to the state.
>
> Or if NM or Arizona wants to continue to support WIDEn-N, then
simply
> trap-out WIDE4-4, WIDE5-5 and WIDE6-6 by putting those in the UIDIGI
so
> that they get stopped at the border.
>
> Actually, I think that is how I woiuld do it.  Keep WIDEn-N in those
> states, but get EVERY DIGI in ALL states to start traping out
WIDE5-5, 6-
> 6
>
>>>> Tom Russo <russo at bogodyn.org> 1/19/05 3:49:07 AM >>>
>>>>
> On Wed, Jan 19, 2005 at 12:53:33AM -0700, we recorded a
bogon-computron
> collision of the <needhame1 at plateautel.net> flavor, containing:
>
>>
>> Hey, I'm in Clovis, New Mexico -- that's about 200 miles east of
>>
>
>> Albuquerque and only 100 miles northwest of Lubbock, Texas, in
>>
> DM84jk.
>
>
> I live near Escabosa, NM, about 20 mi. SE of Albuquerque, in DM64ux.
My
> APRS
> experience here near town is very different from what you're
> experiencing out near Clovis.
>
> At least in my view from near Albuquerque, the WIDEN-n situation is
a
> mess.
>
>> I just got home from a week on the road.  Had a lot of time to
>>
> think
>> about things and listen to the actual audio on 144.39 around the
>>
> country.
>> It was pretty busy in Salt Lake city, not quite so busy near
>>
> Albuquerque,
>
>
> Egad.  If the racket I hear near Albuquerque when *I* turn up the
volume
> on
> the data channel is "not quite so busy" then I don't wanna know what
> busy is.
> I hear almost continuous traffic with obvious signs of overlapping
wide
>
>
> digipeaters stepping all over each other.  As I watch the panel of
my
> D700 when
> in town, the packets are getting clobbered so badly that only a very
> small
> fraction are decoded.  At one point I wondered if it was just
message
> traffic
> the D700 wasn't displaying, but that hope was quashed when I
actually
> watched
> the packet monitor.  It's just undecodable cacophony.
>
>
> Of the nearly 150 stations I've got showing up on my home (RF-only)
> station,
> 81 are digipeaters, most of them WIDEN-n digis, and a large fraction
of
> those
> are in states.  I'm seeing digipeaters from as far away as 500
miles,
> most of
> those using WIDE5-5 or WIDE7-7 paths.  Looking at some of the paths,
> they're
> getting from the NM border to Albuquerque in about 3 hops (in fact,
the
>
>
> farthest station is down near Del Rio, TX --- it took 4 hops to get
to
> the
> first New Mexico digi near Capitan, and two hops from there to get
to
> me).
>
> All of that is brought to me courtesy of the three WIDEN-n digis
that
> constitute the only stations I can hear directly from the home
station.
>
> When I have to mess around with low-power trackers just about
anywhere in
> central NM reliability is marginal or nonexistent, largely because it
is
> difficult for the trackers to get a word in edgewise to the
digipeaters -
> --
> they can't hear the traffic and think the channel's clear, but the
digi
> can't
> hear them because it's too busy listening to 4 other digis non-stop,
> passing
> WIDE7-7 packets from digipeaters in central Texas to the ether near
> central Arizona.
>
> Something that needs fixed here in NM, at least in central NM.  I'm
not
> quite
> sure what it is or how dramatically things need changed, but
something's
> gotta
> get tweaked to get the APRS network cleaned up here.

_______________________________________________
aprssig mailing list
aprssig at lists.tapr.org 
https://lists.tapr.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/aprssig