<div dir="ltr"><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:georgia,serif"><span style="font-family:arial,sans-serif">On Sat, Nov 19, 2016 at 11:32 PM, Lynn W. Deffenbaugh (Mr) </span><span dir="ltr" style="font-family:arial,sans-serif"><<a href="mailto:ldeffenb@homeside.to" target="_blank">ldeffenb@homeside.to</a>></span><span style="font-family:arial,sans-serif"> wrote:</span><br></div><div class="gmail_extra"><div class="gmail_quote"><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">
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<div class="gmail-m_2587855493223967050moz-cite-prefix">Taking the discussion back to the
public list so others don't ask the same questions later...</div></div></blockquote><div><br></div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:georgia,serif">Yeah, that is ok, I was going to re-write a little. comments in-line</div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:georgia,serif"><br></div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:georgia,serif"><span style="font-family:arial,sans-serif;font-size:12.8px">"One IGate delivering packets to port 14580 does not affect any other IGate's connection nor the ability for other IGates to receive messages directed to any received station. The APRS-IS is not "smart". A message addressed to a specific station is delivered to ALL IGates that have recently gated packets from the addressed station."</span><br></div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:georgia,serif"><span style="font-family:arial,sans-serif;font-size:12.8px"><br></span></div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:georgia,serif"><span style="font-family:arial,sans-serif;font-size:12.8px">Agreed & understood. I am only interested in the behaviour of the part of the system I do have control over.</span></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex"><div bgcolor="#FFFFFF"><div class="gmail-m_2587855493223967050moz-cite-prefix"><span class="gmail-"><br>
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On 11/19/2016 10:42 PM, Jim Alles wrote:<br>
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<div style="font-family:georgia,serif"><span style="font-family:arial,sans-serif;font-size:12.8px">"Changing
the port to which received packets are delivered has
absolutely no effect on "fixing" anything."</span><br>
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<div style="font-family:georgia,serif"><span style="font-family:arial,sans-serif;font-size:12.8px">I
believe you are wrong - the packets inserted into the
unidirectional port are not inserted into the heard hash
table.</span></div>
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<div style="font-family:georgia,serif"><span style="font-family:arial,sans-serif;font-size:12.8px">The
APRS-IS is smart enough to not try to send messages back to
you<div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:georgia,serif;display:inline"> for transmission</div> - <div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:georgia,serif;display:inline">IT CAN'T - </div>you aren't there.</span></div>
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But I don't understand just what you think that "fixes"?<br></div></blockquote><div><br></div><div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:georgia,serif;display:inline">Bob's original problem - message packets got dropped until after a position report was received.</div> <div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:georgia,serif;display:inline">Somebody configured something with the limited tools they had., to get control of the useless packets that wanted to be transmitted.</div></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex"><div bgcolor="#FFFFFF">
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Remote operators are still showing up on the APRS-IS and there's
still no indication that they came through a non-transmitting IGate.<br></div></blockquote><div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:georgia,serif;display:inline">yeah, I get that, except that suggests a separate, more complex proposal - put something like NOHERD into the path, and modify the server software to behave differently based on that - but that is not what I am going after, here.</div> <div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:georgia,serif;display:inline">Way over my pay-grade.</div></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex"><div bgcolor="#FFFFFF">
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Not being in the heard table doesn't do anything as far as I can
tell, except prevent your UDP-injecting IGate from receiving
messages that it wouldn't likely have done anything with anyway?</div></blockquote><div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:georgia,serif">1. Reduce bandwidth requirements. As Kenneth mentions, a case was presented elsewhere for an RX only IGate that was on a satellite link, where every byte in either direction costs $. Eliminating the traffic from the server due to an entry in the heard list can be important to some, and that is not 'allowed for' in the design document coupled with the client capability we have. The IGate operator should have the control to be able to make it stop.</div></div><div> </div><div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:georgia,serif">2. Reduce server resource loading. See (I can't find the reference).</div></div><div><br></div><div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:georgia,serif">this may need more explanation.:</div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:georgia,serif">3. Craft the traffic coming back to me from the server by shaping what I insert into the heard table (making it my responsibility) so I am not dealing with cruft from a station that is outside of my ALOHA circle, is not in my local RF territory, and sometimes I hear due to ducting (I guess I shouldn't think 'skip' anymore). Instead of dropping it on the floor, send those undesirable (for our local RF territory) packets to the unidirectional 'sending-only client' port. If one of those happens to be a message, another one survived.</div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:georgia,serif"><br></div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:georgia,serif">I think, to guide people towards an operating procedure that prevents the situation Bob observed, having a client default configuration that sends range & hop filtered <position beacons> to the restricted port (TCP 14580) in order to guide the right messages to me for transmission and ALL objects, messages and other types to UDP port 8080 regardless of where they came from (OK, still no TCPIP in the path).</div></div><div><br></div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:georgia,serif">Though subtle, it will make it easier for people to do what they want/need to do, and less likely to break messaging. At least it would give me more configuration options, to do what I see fit.</div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:georgia,serif"><br></div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:georgia,serif">I am not pretending to be able to lecture anyone here on signal processing, some of you have forgotten more than I will ever know.</div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:georgia,serif">But it has been my experience it is more effective to reduce the noise before processing than try to deal with it afterwards. And a connection to an APRS-IS server on the restricted port does multiply the # of packets I get back from it, in comparison to what I sent to it. I really don't want to send it ALL that I hear.</div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:georgia,serif"><br></div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:georgia,serif">But I do want to make the Centre region a messaging powerhouse.</div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:georgia,serif"><br></div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:georgia,serif">good night,</div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:georgia,serif"><br></div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:georgia,serif">.ja.</div></div></div></div>