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If we're going to push for expanded 9600 baud implementation, can we
pretty please enforce some more rigorous technical standards than on
144.39? For 1200 baud APRS you never know if you're going to see
Bell 202 or V.23, pre-emphasized or flat, deviation could be
anything, the HDLC reset sequence is awful for fast clock recovery
but there's no other standard preamble, you don't know if the
receiving TNC is going to choke on non-printable characters in the
payload or if it's even checking FCS or PID, and you've got tens of
thousands of Kenwood devices that have a fixed 500 ms TXD.<br>
<br>
At 9600 baud there doesn't seem to be much agreement on filter
selection and documentation is scarce.<br>
<br>
You could probably match 1200 baud's Eb/N0 advantage just by
requiring certain basic technical standards on a 9600 baud
network. <br>
<br>
Scott<br>
N1VG<br>
<br>
<div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 5/5/2016 10:59 AM, Brian D Heaton
via aprssig wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote cite="mid:654a5188-6ba4-f5af-981d-ff7baa57ba3c@ky9k.org"
type="cite">
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<div class="moz-cite-prefix">Why KPC9612s and 2M?<br>
<br>
Commercial TNC/Node combos (KPC9612 and others) - Small
computers are available which can provide all the needed/desired
functions and interface to multiple TNCs or sound interfaces.
Recent testing shows that QPSK/4800 is quite reliable via a
sound interface to a radio with a 9600 data port. 9600 is just a
step up the chain from that. I expect xPSK (likely OQPSK or
8PSK) rates of around 19200 are quite achievable. You can still
use KPC9612s if sticking to 9600.<br>
<br>
Many (I will guess "the vast majority") of EOCs already have
issues with desense from multiple radios on 2M. If the
supporting rationale that may make more sites available is
EMCOMM support, I would put the backbone links on either 1.25M
or 70cm with a preference for 1.25M. I would keep the backbone
frequency clear of users to avoid additional congestion and
hidden transmitters. Users could access on 2M/1.25M/70cm
(whichever band the backbone link(s) aren't running on) at
either 1200 or 9600. Why kill performance of an engineered and
well adjusted backbone link/network with user stations?<br>
<br>
73-KY9K/Brian<br>
<br>
<br>
On 5/5/2016 10:29, Robert Bruninga via aprssig wrote:<br>
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cite="mid:1f0c8c0cacd9f4f6e69b6a1c7e07b1d0@mail.gmail.com"
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d">SAVE
your KPC9612’s Boys, the East will RISE AGAIN!</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d"> </span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d">The
Golden Packet team is toying with the idea of making our
annual Appalachian mountain digipeater string from Maine
to Georgia permament and making it a 9600 baud network for
emergency and ham radio disaster response and play. We
already have 3 of the 14 sites with approval for
installations…</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d"> </span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d">Lets
face it, traditional packet networks are dead</span><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d">
and</span><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d">
</span><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d">although
</span><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d">APRS
is alive and well</span><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d">,
it is specific and</span><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d">
only operates at 1200 baud.</span><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d">
Although all fully integrated APRS radios work perfectly
well at 1200 and 9600 baud, </span><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d">all
of the existing APRS network is 1200</span><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d">
because </span><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d">all
the digipeaters (not integrated APRS radios) operate at
1200 and the majority of all home APRS stations</span><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d">
and IGates</span><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d">
use TNC’s</span><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d">
that operate</span><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d">
at 1200</span><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d">.
A huge legacy. Besides, going to 9600 only barely doubles
APRS speeds while degrading link reliability.</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d"> </span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d">So,
since we have already shown for 6 years now, that this
long 2000 mile linear chain of mountains and valleys can
support a 2000 mile network with only 14 digis, why not
establish a long haul 9600 baud Node chain</span><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d">
from Maine to Georgia</span><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d">
which could be a </span><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d">significant
boost to Packet radio emergency operations. </span><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d">The
network would not operate as APRS digipeaters but as
KAnodes. </span><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d"> As
we all knew back in the 1990’s link-by-link acknowledgment
was vastly superior to end-to-end. </span><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d"></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d"> </span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d">We
already have three sites in MD, and PA … But we need more
than hikers, to get us access to some existing ham radio
maintained sites. We do NOT want nodes to branch off down
into the plains. These nodes would bog down the network.
No, the main backbone would be to support emergency
operations with beams that can point up to the mountains
to pass traffic.</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d"> </span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d">So,
we are splashing this onto the APRSSIG to see if people
have SITE access and/or have unused 9600 baud KPC-9612’s
to step up and lets see what we got. Also will need a
freq. I’m thinking 145.01 but every time I think of it,
people give feedback, and I LOSE or forget the feedback as
to what existing systems are already on 145.01, such as DX
clusters, etc…</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:#1f497d"> </span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d">Every
day we get MORE AND MORE addicted to our wireless
infrastructure, which we all know, will be hard to access
in a real emergency. We need to keep the Ham radio Plan-B
alive…</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d"> </span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d">Bob,
WB4APR</span></p>
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