<div dir="ltr">Quite honestly several folks have over the years created symbols. It would be nice if we as a group created a shared repo with symbols containing both raster and vector formats and corporately maintained them.<div>
<br></div><div>Greg</div></div><div class="gmail_extra"><br><br><div class="gmail_quote">On Thu, Aug 28, 2014 at 9:42 AM, Robert Bruninga <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:bruninga@usna.edu" target="_blank">bruninga@usna.edu</a>></span> wrote:<br>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div lang="EN-US" link="blue" vlink="purple"><div><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d">Yes, give me your ideas, and we can add them to the list. Then the actual icon files can be updated.</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d">I will apply two general rules of common sense to add them to the definitions list:</span></p><p>
<span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d"><span>1)<span style="font:7.0pt "Times New Roman""> </span></span></span><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d">Is it a good idea, which will see general use?</span></p>
<p><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d"><span>2)<span style="font:7.0pt "Times New Roman""> </span></span></span><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d">Will it also make sense on older systems (base symbol with a meaningful overlay character)?</span></p>
<p><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d"><span>3)<span style="font:7.0pt "Times New Roman""> </span></span></span><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d">Or is it just using up symbols space, making a lot of work for a lot of people, with little benefit to all.</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d"> </span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d">Then with respect to updating various ICON files, I will let the authors agree who is making what changes to what data base so that we don’t have multiple incompatible versions and the effort is organized.</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d"> </span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d">I know that Hessu is investing a massive effort in the symbol set for <a href="http://APRS.FI" target="_blank">APRS.FI</a> and trying to generalize it. Let’s let him speak up on his effort, and then see how that trickles down to the UI data base and so on. I think <a href="http://APRS.FI" target="_blank">APRS.FI</a> is the elephant in the room, so lets see what he has to say. I admit, I cant keep track of the details.</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d"> </span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d">Someone did give a good summary once as to how many different base symbol sets there are, IE… a lot of clients use the UIVIEW symbol files which is great for commonality. But I do not know all the others.</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d"> </span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d">Maybe someone can summarize once again a list of the fundamental ICON file sources, and lets work on those at the source.</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d"> </span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d">*** NOTICE *** That to make all this work, in 2007, we made a fundamental change to a lot of weather symbols to consolidate them and free up all this BASE symbol set. That has to be done first. Has it been done?</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d"> </span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d">For example,. Original APRS had completely different symbols for Rain, Snow, Freezing rain, drizzle, Blowing snow, Sleet, etc. Since 2004, all PRECIPITIAION gets one “base symbol” and then the type of precipitation is indicated with an OVERLAY. Thus giving us 36 different types of precipitation and freeing up at least a half dozen of BASE symbols for other uses.</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d"> </span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d">Read about it in this in the bottom half of the <a href="http://aprs.org/symbols/symbols-new.txt" target="_blank">http://aprs.org/symbols/symbols-new.txt</a></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d"> </span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d">Has this movement of most weather symbols to overlays been done in all clients? Once this has been done, then that frees up 11 new BASE symbols times 36 each or over 390 new potential symbols (but ONLY with 11 BASE symbols for backwards compatibility.). </span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d">Nailing down these last 11 new categories will be critical and will lock us in. So these need to be very judiciously chosen.</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d"> </span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d">So far, we have not needed to use ANY of these, because I have been able to map almost all new ideas into existing base symbols.</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d"> </span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d">Bob, WB4APR</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d"> </span></p><div><div style="border:none;border-top:solid #b5c4df 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in">
<p class="MsoNormal">
<b><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"">From:</span></b><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif""> <a href="mailto:aprssig-bounces@tapr.org" target="_blank">aprssig-bounces@tapr.org</a> [mailto:<a href="mailto:aprssig-bounces@tapr.org" target="_blank">aprssig-bounces@tapr.org</a>] <b>On Behalf Of </b>andrewemt<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Thursday, August 28, 2014 11:08 AM<br><b>To:</b> TAPR APRS Mailing List<br><b>Subject:</b> Re: [aprssig] New icon images</span></p></div></div><p class="MsoNormal"> </p><p class="MsoNormal">Bob, </p><div><p class="MsoNormal">
</p></div><div><p class="MsoNormal">So if I submit a proposal for symbol assignments to you and update the UI-View icon files to match and send them to Steve for posting, would that at least get things rolling? </p><div>
<p class="MsoNormal"> </p></div><div><p class="MsoNormal">Andrew, KA2DDO</p></div></div><p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:12.0pt"><br><br>-------- Original message --------<br>From: Robert Bruninga <<a href="mailto:bruninga@usna.edu" target="_blank">bruninga@usna.edu</a>> <br>
Date:08/28/2014 11:04 (GMT-05:00) <br>To: TAPR APRS Mailing List <<a href="mailto:aprssig@tapr.org" target="_blank">aprssig@tapr.org</a>> <br>Cc: <br>Subject: Re: [aprssig] New icon images </p><div><div><p class="MsoNormal">
Actually, the symbol space has been opened up form the original 100 or so<br>
to thousands (by judicious use of "overlay" characters on a basic set of<br>symbols. This is backwards compatible. Those with older systems see the<br>base symbol with the overlay character, those with newser systems "can"<br>
see any new specially drawn symbols that matches that unique combination<br>of base symbol and overlay. See some of the examples on<br><a href="http://aprs.org/symbols.html" target="_blank">http://aprs.org/symbols.html</a><br>
<br>Follow the link to symbols-new.txt and you will see several of these<br>
expansions. As many as a dozen different symbol definitions for some of<br>the basic symbols.<br><br>The PROBLEM is that now it takes a massive effort by software developers<br>to render actual images to match these new definitions. And to keep<br>
current, which is a daunting task. But at least the "symbol space" is<br>available to contain these thousands of new possibilities. In other<br>words, I accommodated it in the spec and simply passed the buck to the<br>
code writers...<br><br>Bob, WB4APR<br><br><br>-----Original Message-----<br>From: <a href="mailto:aprssig-bounces@tapr.org" target="_blank">aprssig-bounces@tapr.org</a> [<a href="mailto:aprssig-bounces@tapr.org" target="_blank">mailto:aprssig-bounces@tapr.org</a>] On Behalf<br>
Of Steve Dimse<br>Sent: Thursday, August 28, 2014 9:08 AM<br>To: TAPR APRS Mailing List<br>Subject: Re: [aprssig] New icon images<br><br><br>On Aug 28, 2014, at 5:57 AM, Andrew P. <<a href="mailto:andrewemt@hotmail.com" target="_blank">andrewemt@hotmail.com</a>> wrote:<br>
<br>> Uh, isn't that why Kenwood makes firmware upgrades available on their<br>website?<br>><br>The original Kenwoods have to be opened and programming cable soldered<br>onto the circuit board to update the firmware. The circuit board was a<br>
design that Kenwood had developed but never released for the Japanese<br>market. It was obsolete even before it was released in the late 90s! After<br>its release there were so many bugs Kenwood had to issue one, but it was a<br>
headache, you either had to send it to them or go to one of the few<br>hamfests to which they sent techs, in which case they could flash it while<br>you waited. I'm sure they are not going to do that again!<br><br>> In any case, what is the mechanism for proposing symbol code assignments<br>
for these meanings, and which meanings are important enough to get added?<br>><br>The APRS Working Group, which these days is down to Bob. I suspect he does<br>not want to open the floodgates as there have been many, many proposals<br>
over the years of individuals that wanted a symbol, and of course there<br>are only a few unassigned. Unless it is something with widespread ham<br>appeal I suspect he isn't going to act.<br><br>I think a backward compatible extended symbol space is your best bet, then<br>
everyone can add all the symbols they want.<br><br>Steve K4HG<br>_______________________________________________<br>aprssig mailing list<br><a href="mailto:aprssig@tapr.org" target="_blank">aprssig@tapr.org</a><br><a href="http://www.tapr.org/mailman/listinfo/aprssig" target="_blank">http://www.tapr.org/mailman/listinfo/aprssig</a><br>
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<br></blockquote></div><br><br clear="all"><div><br></div>-- <br>NV6G<br>OpenAPRS.Net<br>OpenAPRS iPhone Edition<br>Find RC sites and weather in your area on iPhone/iPad with WhereBRC
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