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<br><div><div>On Sep 15, 2007, at 9:03 AM, Bob Bruninga wrote:</div><br class="Apple-interchange-newline"><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><blockquote type="cite"><div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "><span class="Apple-style-span" style="-webkit-text-stroke-width: -1; ">Then how is the sender or anyone else to know that this person is using a path that is inconsistent with the New-N paradigm? You change his path, and so the sender never will...</span></div></blockquote></blockquote></blockquote><div><br class="webkit-block-placeholder"></div>How does your method work any better? Seems to me that the offender never gets digi'd and nobody hears him. He/She gets frustrated because things don't work and gives up. Maybe they ask for help and maybe they don't.</div><div><br class="webkit-block-placeholder"></div><div>At least with my method, they will get out and somebody will eventually notice their path and teach them what they should be doing. </div><div><br class="webkit-block-placeholder"></div><div>Perhaps they even notice that their path has been modified and they correct it themselves. They see themselves sending out WIDE7-7 and the digi sends it back out as WIDE3-2. They give a call out on the local repeater and ask about it and learn. I'd rather have that then the guy agonizing over why his local digi won't digi him.</div><div><br></div><div><blockquote type="cite"><div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; min-height: 14px; "><span class="Apple-style-span" style="-webkit-text-stroke-width: -1; ">Then how is this out-dated user ever going to learn that his path is obsolete? You change his path, and so the sender never will... And you have done him a great disservice, since his mobile will not work anywhere else, and he does not know that because of your digi's crutches.</span></div></blockquote><div><br class="webkit-block-placeholder"></div><div>So, you would rather have him not digipeated at all anywhere? I'd rather give these guys a shot at making it into the network in the hopes that they will learn.</div><div><br></div><div>A local in my area using an incorrect path will be noticed as he'll appear on my map. I'll take a look at his packets to see who the op is and what kind of equipment he/she is running. Hey, he's got an incorrect path so I'll shoot him a note giving him some information to correct it. Then when he travels, he'll have the correct setup.</div><div><br class="webkit-block-placeholder"></div><div>With your approach, the guy never gets noticed. He might seek out help or he might just give up in frustration.</div><div><br class="webkit-block-placeholder"></div><blockquote type="cite"><div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "><span class="Apple-style-span" style="-webkit-text-stroke-width: -1; ">Teachers do not correct the misspellings of their students and send the work forward, but they mark the errors and send them back so the student learns.</span></div></blockquote><div><br class="webkit-block-placeholder"></div><div>Teachers are not deaf to their students but listen and correct.</div><div><br class="webkit-block-placeholder"></div><div>You turn a deaf ear to them and ignore them. The students are never heard by the teacher and only if one of the other students can hear him, he'll get help.</div><div><br class="webkit-block-placeholder"></div><div>Heck, it's Bob's network and if they don't conform, I'm not digi'ing them.</div><div><br></div><blockquote type="cite"> <blockquote type="cite"><div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "><span class="Apple-style-span" style="-webkit-text-stroke-width: -1; ">In my opinion, that is exactly the wrong thing to do. If it "works" in your area because of your digi's crutches, then they will never have the incentive to fix it. But the problem remains, they have learned nothing, and then their performance dies as soon as they leave the area which might be when they need it most.</span></div></blockquote></blockquote><div><br class="webkit-block-placeholder"></div><div>You are assuming they won't correct things. Most hams I know are good listeners and network users. Perhaps things are different in your area?</div><div><br class="webkit-block-placeholder"></div><blockquote type="cite"><div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; ">Hope that helps</div><div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; ">Bob, Wb4APR</div></blockquote><br></div><div>Not really. I choose to let the uneducated into the network in order to let them get started and then educate them. </div><div><br class="webkit-block-placeholder"></div><div>You choose to ignore them completely as they don't conform to your paradigm.</div><div><br></div><div> <p style="margin: 0.0px 0.0px 0.0px 0.0px"><font face="Geneva" size="3" style="font: 12.0px Geneva">--</font></p> <p style="margin: 0.0px 0.0px 0.0px 0.0px"><font face="Geneva" size="3" style="font: 12.0px Geneva">Steve <steve.jones at rogers.com></font></p> <p style="margin: 0.0px 0.0px 0.0px 0.0px; font: 12.0px Geneva; min-height: 16.0px"><br></p> <br class="Apple-interchange-newline"> </div><br></body></html>