[aprssig] Multiple SSID's from one station, with the New N Paradigm.
Dave Baxter
Dave at emv.co.uk
Tue Dec 16 07:18:11 EST 2008
Cheers Bob...
Current suspects involve a rouge D700 somewhere. It's also prevelant in
France, and Ireland too it seems. The decrementing of the originating
SSID that is, both those areas use WIDEn-N, though it has been seen with
TRACEn-N too, though not as bad.
I know DigiNed, and am planning on using it sometime (or AGW Digi) so
will take care with the settings, and get people to test it.
Cheers.
Dave G0WBX
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Bob Donnell [mailto:kd7nm at pugetsound.net]
> Sent: 15 December 2008 20:33
> To: 'TAPR APRS Mailing List'
> Subject: Re: [aprssig] Multiple SSID's from one station,with
> the New N Paradigm.
>
> If I had to venture a guess, someone on the network has tried
> to implement WIDEn-n with digined, or some other
> user-configurable softare handling the digipeating function.
> That station has a bad configuration, one that instead of
> decrementing the digipeating SSID, is instead, decrementing
> the sending station SSID. There are not too many choices of
> widely disseminated software available, in that regard. With
> all of the different things that have been tried on APRS in
> the Pacific Northwest, the problem you've documented is not a
> problem that I've ever seen reported having been done
> locally. Don't feel like a Lone Ranger. A number of
> modifications to the APRS digipeating paradigms have had
> their roots here. Just like roots, some of those roots seem
> to run into solid obstacles, which slows their growth.
>
> 73, Bob, KD7NM
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: aprssig-bounces at tapr.org
> [mailto:aprssig-bounces at tapr.org] On Behalf Of Dave Baxter
> Sent: Monday, December 15, 2008 12:52 AM
> To: TAPR APRS Mailing List
> Subject: Re: [aprssig] Multiple SSID's from one station,with
> the New N Paradigm.
>
> Hi Keith....
>
> Nope, the sending station only used one ssid -15. There is something
> elsewhere in the network (such as it is) that is causing this. It is
> one of the several reasons why England has not moved to Newn-N in the
> past. There is strong anecdotal evidence that misconfigured
> D700's are
> a probable cause.
>
> Believe me, trying to explain to several people who still
> think that the new WIDEn-N system is the same as WIDE (and
> not tracable) is a near vertical struggle. They keep talking
> about this and not making clear which paradigm they are
> talking about, just to add to the confusion.
>
> Regards.
>
> Dave G0WBX
>
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: Keith VE7GDH [mailto:ve7gdh at rac.ca]
> > Sent: 13 December 2008 22:09
> > To: TAPR APRS Mailing List
> > Subject: Re: [aprssig] Multiple SSID's from one
> station,with the New N
> > Paradigm.
> >
> > Dave G0WBX wrote...
> >
> > > Following the recent IARU R1 meeting in Cavtat, and the resulting
> > > recommendation that Region 1 adopts the Newn-N paradigm...
> >
> > I was pleased to hear that. There's a lot to be said for having
> > universal settings that will work everywhere without having to
> > reprogram as you travel.
> >
> > > several people in the UK APRS network have been
> > investigating how best
> > > to adopt it. Notwithstanding that many think it's not
> necessary to
> > > change from RELAY,TRACEn-N to WIDE1-1,WIDEn-N etc, for many
> > reasons,
> > > not least this following behaviour seen on air..
> >
> > > 2008-12-08 14:36:12 UTC:
> > > G7III-15>APRS,MB7UW*,WIDE5-3,qAR,G0CGL-12
> > > :!5124.12N/00046.23W& Test Dup SSID: W5-5
> >
> > > 2008-12-08 14:36:21 UTC:
> > > G7III-14>APRS,MB7UW*,WIDE5-3,qAR,G0WKM-2
> > >:!5124.12N/00046.23W& Test Dup SSID: W5-5
> >
> > > 2008-12-08 14:36:25 UTC:
> > > G7III-13>APRS,MB7UW*,WIDE5-2,qAR,G0WKM-2
> > > :!5124.12N/00046.23W& Test Dup SSID: W5-5
> >
> > > 2008-12-08 14:36:36 UTC:
> > > G7III-12>APRS,MB7UW*,WIDE5-1,qAR,G0WKM-2
> > > :!5124.12N/00046.23W& Test Dup SSID: W5-5
> >
> > > Note the decrementing SSID of G7III, this is caused by a digi
> > > somewhere in the network, but is proving illusive to track
> > down. G7III
> > > of course only used one SSID, -15.
> > >
> > > It is (again I'm told) one of the main reasons why the UK (well,
> > > England at least) has stuck with RELAY,TRACEn-N as it
> doesnt happen
> > > with that path method.
> >
> > In North America, we have made WIDEn-N traceable and the
> old TRACEn-N
> > isn't used... except for a few hold-outs. We could instead adopt
> > TRACEn-N and make that traceable againa, but that would involve a
> > change for many thousands of users. Not that it makes a lot of
> > difference, but WIDEn-N saves one byte compared to TRACEn-N, but of
> > course the length of the digipeated packet increases each
> time it is
> > digipeated.
> > However, the advantage is in being able to see the actual
> path and no
> > dupes. Yes, you have tht now with the old TRACEn-N, but I
> think it is
> > a very worthwhile goal to have universal settings.
> >
> > RELAY isn't traceable and can lead to dupes and
> ping-ponging between
> > digis.
> >
> > In the example above, it appears the SSID was changed by the
> > originating station... G7III-15, G7III-14, G7III-13, G7III-12. The
> > beacon comment indicates "Test Dup SSID". Are you saying that G7III
> > only transmitted with one SSID? If so, something screwy is going on.
> >
> > > Someone has said this... "...there is a D700 somewhere
> > with UIFLOOD
> > > set with NOID enabled." Is this the case, or is there
> > something else
> > > happening?
> >
> > I'm not sure what is causing it.
> >
> > > Was this odd behaviour seen in the USA when the New WIDEn-N
> > system was
> > > first rolled out? If so, how did you track it down and fix it?
> >
> > No. There was a transition period where most digis and
> mobile stations
> > changed over, but I've never heard of what was shown in the
> examples
> > you provided going on if the originating station wasn't
> changing the
> > SSID.
> > Perhaps someone within earshot of G7III and some of the
> nearby digis
> > might be able to observe what is going on. The WIDEn-N should
> > decrement.
> > The callsign-SSID of the originating station should most
> definitely be
> > changing.
> >
> > 73 es cul - Keith VE7GDH
> > --
> > "I may be lost, but I know exactly where I am!"
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
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