[aprssig] Re: Unreasonable xmission delay

Sat Jul 15 02:10:05 EDT 2006

I see delays of 2-4 minutes on duplicate reports frequently.  Here is
a sample; you can the RMC time, and the time the packet was received,
and the path data.  I don't think it is the Igate program per se.
N7WLC and N6EX-3 are running the same program javAPRS, with EX-3 being
one version newer.  W9IF is running APRSD.  KB6JAG is running UIView.
In this example, reports from N6EX-3 are running 2 to 2.5 minutes
behind the original report, with the first instance of each report
being very soon after the packet was generated.  I saw the same type
of delay in the Bay area coming from a UIView station.  So is it the
IGate, or the APRS-IS?   I don't know.  I do know, this delay problem
is common for the stations I observe.

KH2JB-9 2/$RMC:150551,A 2006/07/15 05:52:26
I:GPSC18,W6SCE-10*,WIDE2-1,qAR,N6EX-3
KH2JB-9 1/$RMC:150550,A 2006/07/15 05:52:06 I:GPSC17,N6EX-4*,qAR,N6EX-3
KH2JB-9 2/$RMC:150551,A 2006/07/15 05:50:59 I:GPSC18,W6SCE-10*,WIDE2-1,qAR,N7WLC
KH2JB-9 1/$RMC:150550,A 2006/07/15 05:49:59 I:GPSC17,W6SCE-10*,WIDE2-1,qAR,W9IF
KH2JB-9 2/$RMC:150546,A 2006/07/15 05:48:17
I:GPSC18,W6SCE-10*,WIDE2-1,qAR,N6EX-3
KH2JB-9 2/$RMC:150545,A 2006/07/15 05:47:09
I:GPSC18,WB6JAR-10,W6SCE-10*,qAR,N6EX-3
KH2JB-9 2/$RMC:150546,A 2006/07/15 05:46:59 I:GPSC18,W6SCE-10*,WIDE2-1,qAR,N7WLC
KH2JB-9 1/$RMC:150544,A 2006/07/15 05:45:53
I:GPSC17,WB6JAR-10,W6SCE-10*,qAR,N6EX-3
KH2JB-9 2/$RMC:150545,A 2006/07/15 05:44:59
I:GPSC18,WB6JAR-10*,WIDE2-1,qAO,KB6JAG
KH2JB-9 1/$RMC:150544,A 2006/07/15 05:43:58
I:GPSC17,WB6JAR-10*,WIDE2-1,qAO,KB6JAG
KH2JB-9 1/$RMC:150542,A 2006/07/15 05:43:20 I:GPSC17,WIDE1-1,WIDE2-1,qAR,N6EX-3
KH2JB-9 2/$RMC:150541,A 2006/07/15 05:42:40 I:GPSC18,N6EX-4*,qAR,N6EX-3
KH2JB-9 1/$RMC:150542,A 2006/07/15 05:41:58
I:GPSC17,WB6JAR-10*,WIDE2-1,qAO,KB6JAG
KH2JB-9 2/$RMC:150541,A 2006/07/15 05:40:58
I:GPSC18,WB6JAR-10*,WIDE2-1,qAO,KB6JAG

On 7/14/06, Tim Cunningham <tim_cunningham at mindspring.com> wrote:
> The problem is not the W4GPS-7 digipeater. The problem is deeper.
>
> I do not think this is a digipeater delay problem. It is likely an APRS-IS
> or FINDU problem. The delays on the network are horrific. Lately, I have
> been watching FINDU to see how things are working on the network. I noticed
> that all the local traffic here was showing up on FINDU as being relayed by
> KG4PID and KQ4TV internet gates. Since we just repaired the N8DEU-4 gateway
> and put it back on the air in place of the temporary N8DEU-2 gateway, I was
> watching the activity and scratching my head on how the remote IGates could
> be passing the direct and local traffic before the N8DEU-4 IGate. Then I
> seen Coe's message and realized something else was seriously wrong.
>
> The following sample packets pulled from FINDU show how much delay is being
> encountered. There is over 1 minute from one gateway and 10 minutes from
> another gateway. I doubt this is a digipeater issue from what I can seen
> happening repeatedly in different directions.
>
>
> 20060714194906,N8DEU-12>S4TX1X,WIDE1-1,WIDE2-1,qAo,N8DEU-4:'rEll"9j/]"7+}
> 20060714195019,N8DEU-12>S4TX1X,W4GPS-7,WIDE1,KU4WW-1*,WIDE2,qAo,KG4PID-15:'rEll"9j/]"7+}
> 20060714195939,N8DEU-12>S4TX1X,W4GPS-7,WIDE1,NT4UX-2,WIDE2*,qAR,KQ4TV-1:'rEll"9j/]"7+}
>
> 20060715003528,W4GPS-7>APZ19,WIDE2-2,qAo,N8DEU-4:!3438.07NS08630.74W#PHG5630/W3,ALn
> Huntsville Alabama
> 20060715003639,W4GPS-7>APZ19,WIDE2-2,qAo,KG4PID-15:!3438.07NS08630.74W#PHG5630/W3,ALn
> Huntsville Alabama
> 20060715004448,W4GPS-7>APZ19,NT4UX-2,NT4UX-3,WIDE2*,qAR,KQ4TV-1:!3438.07NS08630.74W#PHG5630/W3,ALn
> Huntsville Alabama
>
>
> KG4PID-15 hears the same packet as N8DEU-4 in the second example, but yet
> there is a 1min 11sec delay. Now, NT4UX-2 digipeater hears the packet
> directly and NT4UX-3 picks it up for KQ4TV-1 where there is a 9min 20sec
> delay before it gets to the FINDU system. FINDU cannot remove these
> duplicate packets, because of the amount of time that has passed.
>
> What in the world is happening here?
>
> We know that W4GPS-7 digipeats packets immediately. N8DEU-4 is not a high
> speed rocket ship computer. It is a measly P166 running APRS+SA under
> Windows.
>
>
>
>
>
> 73's de Tim - N8DEU
> Huntsville, AL
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Richard Montgomery" <kb4ytm at gmail.com>
> To: "TAPR APRS Mailing List" <aprssig at lists.tapr.org>
> Sent: Friday, July 14, 2006 10:02 PM
> Subject: Re: [aprssig] Re: Unreasonable xmission delay
>
>
> > Hey Bruce,
> >
> > Considering he (K4COE) is beaconing every 30 seconds, in 5 minutes time he
> > has sent an additional 10 packets. That would be really strange for a digi
> > to hold that particular packet for 5 minutes, when he has sent that many
> > more.
> >
> > Looks like W4GPS-7 is a UIDigi firmware digi with a WX station connected.
> > Possibly a problem with a tnc2 doing both? Too much data from K4COE?
> >
> > Let me know if you need any logs or anything from down this way.
> >
> > Richard
> > KB4YTM
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Bruce W. Martin, KQ4TV wrote:
> >> I received the following information today.
> >> NT4UX-2 is a UIdigi v1.93 using N8DEU's reccomended settings.
> >> KQ4TV-1 is a javAPRSSrvr 3.11b03 Igate.
> >>
> >> Can anyone shed light on what can be done to eliminate 5 minutes of delay
> >> for 100 miles of 3 hops.
> >>
> >> Bruce, KQ4TV
> >>
> >>
> >> On Jul 14, 2006, at 1:57 PM, Case, Coe wrote:
> >>
> >>> Bruce:
> >>>
> >>> Please evaluate the following raw data from FINDU.
> >>>
> >>> 20060714122325,K4COE>S4TS1V,WIDE1-1,WIDE2-1,qAo,N8DEU-4:`rAf!hW>/]"3r}
> >>> 20060714122427,K4COE>S4TR9X,WIDE1-1,WIDE2-1,qAo,N8DEU-4:`rB\nsF>/]"3r}CERT,SkyWarn,RACES,ARES
> >>> ....
> >>> 20060714122815,K4COE>S4TS1V,W4GPS-7,WIDE1,NT4UX-2,WIDE2*,qAR,KQ4TV-1:`rAf!hW>/]"3r}
> >>> 20060714122941,K4COE>S4TR9X,W4GPS-7,WIDE1,NT4UX-2,WIDE2*,qAR,KQ4TV-1:`rB\nsF>/]"3r}CERT,SkyWarn,RACES,ARES
> >>> It appears there is a 5 minute delay in nt4ux-2 and kq4tv-1
> >>> retransmission and igate posting to the internet.  It is causing FINDU
> >>> to overwrite current data with data and locations that are 5 minutes
> >>> old.  Two hops should be a worst case 20 sec delay, not 5 minutes.
> >>>
> >>> If you are working/Tracking vehicle to vehicle (not via the internet),
> >>> then getting to the first i-gate means nothing, you still need to wideN
> >>> to get to the other vehicle's mobile APRS.  Besides, as you can see from
> >>> my track displays over the last 3 weeks, I travel through area's that
> >>> even three hops do not get to any digi/igate.  (Colorado, South
> >>> Carolina, Louisianna as endpoints)
> >>>
> >>> Thanks,
> >>>
> >>> K4coe
> >>
> >>
> >> _______________________________________________
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> >>
> >
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> >
>
>
>
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